Parking enforcement around Sheffield [Archive]

dragonsoup

31-08-2006, 19:20

Dear Foo Fighter:
"Yeah whatever" is all I can summon up
So I have a crap keyboard and my typing skills are substandard

Dear dragonsoup
What you have said is unacceptable, I think it outrageous if this kind of behaviour is being sanctioned by the police.
Can anybody else back this up?
If not then I might consider driving next time myself

Deepak
There has been a thread about this before which I think may have been pulled as usual by the pc brigade. This was some time ago but I can assure you that the same thing is still happening on Fridays. I notice as I take the car to my wifes workplace on a Friday sometimes and walk past the 'place of worship' on my way home. Ive mentioned it often to the wardens who will happily dish out tickets to people who have to be at Weston Park Hospital , but ignore the people visiting the university owned property that I mentioned earlier. Perhaps the University of Sheffield should be made aware of this

S8 Blade

31-08-2006, 20:08

I see them outside my work (in town) on one of the side streets. Especially ticketing diasbled-badged cars, as they always thought they could park on there (double yellows) - obv not. Our delivery driver got a ticket at 8.30am on a Saturday morning - don't know how they think he's going to do his job!! Carting boxes up and down the moor.. they want him to go to a car park and load stuff up and down the stairs?!

Sometimes it's funny watching people get done, as you see them parking there, same time, same day of the week, just to run to other side of moor to go to cash point.. and it serves them right really!!! Then you see those just dropping people off, or mum's with prams that have been given a lift, or those with disabilities that, again, have been given a lift and they get told to move or they're going to get a ticket...

You'd think maybe they'd use their common sense and discretion in a situation like that but... obviously not!

bluebird62

31-08-2006, 20:23

In 20 years I dont think ive ever seen more than a handful of traffic wardens in Sheffield
Now they are all over the place
Im talking in the last week or so
Deepal_S7

Not one in Darnall and we could do with some, cars are parked across crossings by the asians and on double yellow lines. They are even double parked. the other day we were coming along main road opposite Dobsons when a car braked and an asian ran out of the papershop, low and behold they were chatting. By now we had a trail of cars behind all hooting their hooters before he went on his way again. This is not the first time this has happened but upteen times a day, also the taxi drivers when they park 1 car on pavement and 2 on the road all chatting noone can get passed. Upto ten years ago parking on pavements was illegal, but now the asians are doing it and nothing is ever said. There used to be 2 friendly traffic wardens on Darnall but since they have been put into the charge office, the corporation have taken over with their parking attendants they do not sem to have the power the traffic wardens had, now all hell has been let loose on Darnall.
I am not racist but i always speak the truth of what i see. I have been brought up that the truth never hurt any one.

gnomi

31-08-2006, 20:30

Yep,ive noticed loads in walkley,particularly on south road.
Last week i was in netto,when one of the checkout women shouted to the customers that 'they' were coming-it was soo funny,as virtually the whole shop legged it outside to move their cars :hihi:

devlin

31-08-2006, 20:43

One reason guys.............. they are no longer linked to the police.........they are Sheffield City Council Employees. ..The more of them there are.........the more £££££££££££££££ for SCC.

Planner1

01-09-2006, 01:03

The Police knew that responsibility for enforcing parking restrictions was being transferred to the Council for quite some time, so they ran down their Warden service, leving just a handful of them to cover the area. That's why you never used to see any. When the Council took over responsibility only 3 traffic wardens transferred to us.

The Council now have around 40 Parking Attendants so you will see them more often around the place.

The new Broomhill Residents Parking scheme comes into operation on Monday 4th September and improved levels of enforcement will be a feature. There will be a number of Attendants allocated to patrol the area every day. However, in the first two weeks of operation we will only be issuing warning notices to people who transgress in the limited waiting and permit parking bays, so that everyone has time to get used to the new arrangements.

Anyone wanting to report a parking problem which needs enforcement action can contact Parking Services on 2736158 email parkingservices@sheffield.gov.uk

Deepak_S7

01-09-2006, 06:42

Planner1

01-09-2006, 09:45

Thank you Planner1

What you describe is exactly how it feels
No wardens then all of a sudden we have plenty to go round

Do you have any comment about the allegations behind the New Jessops on Fridays?

Clearly there are massive issues if it is true

Deepak

I have spoken to the Parking Services Manager who advises that all streets in that area are enforced with equal vigour. To show that we are actually enforcing in the area you mention: Severn Road 547 penalty charge notices issued in last financial year, Beaufort Road 579 notices issued.

This area is part of the Broomhill Residents Parking Zone and as I explained in my earlier post, there will be a number of Parking Attendants dedicated to patrol that zone every day. So enforcement should be even better.

dragonsoup

01-09-2006, 19:04

The new Broomhill Residents Parking scheme comes into operation on Monday 4th September and improved levels of enforcement will be a feature. There will be a number of Attendants allocated to patrol the area every day. However, in the first two weeks of operation we will only be issuing warning notices to people who transgress in the limited waiting and permit parking bays, so that everyone has time to get used to the new arrangements.

Anyone wanting to report a parking problem which needs enforcement action can contact Parking Services on 2736158 email

In other words they will carry on doing exactly what they want to , whilst the rest of the tax paying , law abiding people get tickets...sick

and forget ringing numbers to complain...god are you serious?

Ordinary people will sort out this countrys problems, not police or politicians. They dont give a ****

Lestat

01-09-2006, 19:15

Deepak S7 . . any chance of sending some of them thaar wardens down to S4

dragonsoup

01-09-2006, 19:38

I have spoken to the Parking Services Manager who advises that all streets in that area are enforced with equal vigour. To show that we are actually enforcing in the area you mention: Severn Road 547 penalty charge notices issued in last financial year, Beaufort Road 579 notices issued.

This area is part of the Broomhill Residents Parking Zone and as I explained in my earlier post, there will be a number of Parking Attendants dedicated to patrol that zone every day. So enforcement should be even better.

These fines will not be paid, that is why the old traffic wardens did not bother to issue tickets . You already know all this stuff so stop bull****ting and tell the truth. Ask the cheif constable

bglodge

02-09-2006, 00:14

These fines will not be paid, that is why the old traffic wardens did not bother to issue tickets . You already know all this stuff so stop bull****ting and tell the truth. Ask the cheif constable

I can assure you that any tickets issued are enforceable through the courts - and the City Council does follow up on tickets.

It's another of these anomolies that we see from drivers - we all want to keep the traffic flowing; we all want to park where it's most convenient / on the door step; yet everyone complains if they get a ticket. Last year, I went out with a couple of the parking attendants. I was absolutely astounded by the behaviour of some motorists. We were on one of the side roads off Ecclesall Road, an area that is reported to the Council by residents and traders as a problem area (Hotspot). I witnessed the attendants advising a number of drivers that they would get a ticket if they parked on the double yellow lines. Some accepted this advice and moved whilst others called their bluff. Drivers pulled up alongside me and saw the parking attendants issuing tickets. When I told them that the were likely to get a ticket if they left the car where it was, questions were asked about where there were signs to advise motorists. Apart from the yellow lines, I pointed out the notices on poles along the roadside - particularly funny when one woman had to step around the sign as she got out of her car. Pleasantly surprising was the comment from one trader that told me the wardens regularly checked if a driver was in one of the surrounding shops, giving the opportunity to move the car before a ticket was issued. Clearly, this flies in the face of the urban myths about wardens hiding behind hedges / walls / etc, waiting to pounce on motorists - but, hey, why let facts get in the way of a good story?

stejen

02-09-2006, 07:59

H.P

02-09-2006, 15:16

On the subject of traffic wardens, we were in town the other day and there was a warden merrily slapping a ticket on a wedding car parked outside the townhall :shocked: :hihi:

Deepak_S7

02-09-2006, 18:05

Anyone wanting to report a parking problem which needs enforcement action can contact Parking Services on 2736158

If I phone this number what are the chances of getting a warden out on a motorbike or van to issue a ticket to a dangerously parked car?
If so how long would it take?

Maybe I'll give it a go
Theres a van been parked at the bottom of Psalter Lane causing an obstruction on a double yellow all day.........

When the Broomhill scheme starts this week will you be stationing wardens around the schools off Clarkehouse Road?
I see its all now pay and display so there is nowhere to drop off private schoolchildren - I am fascinated to see how this pans out, I imagine (hope) there is a fortune to be made in fines

So, to be blunt, will you routinely station wardens round the private schools at 830am and 330pm?

Please please please :)

saxon51

02-09-2006, 18:16

If I phone this number what are the chances of getting a warden out on a motorbike or van to issue a ticket to a dangerously parked car?
If so how long would it take?
I think I might give this a go starting next week when all the idiots start parking on the yellow zig-zags outside the school, when they come to pick up their kids.:thumbsup:

dragonsoup

03-09-2006, 17:12

DRAGONSOUP
why do you keep refering to the chief constable when it has already been correctly stated that parking is no longer a police issue,also why keep slating the wardens they are issuing the tickets,what happens then is out of their hands if you want to rant at someone it should be at the administrators not the front line staff who can only do their bit.
I refer to the chief constable because that is who I was told to refer to by the people who dish out the tickets, which if you could be bothered to analyze my statement , you could have worked out without having to ask. Are you a copper?
I hear you can get in now with a size of 4'10'' and an IQ which is sub 100

stejen

03-09-2006, 19:17

Ravenger

03-09-2006, 19:53

I hope all Sheffield's parking tickets have both a date of issue and a date of contravention, otherwise they're not legally enforcable, as Leeds city council have found out to their cost:

http://www.leedstoday.net/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=39&ArticleID=1690664

Also for parking regulations to be enforced the signs and road markings must conform exactly to the laws in the appropriate road traffic acts. For instance if a double yellow line doesn't have a t-bar terminator or isn't continuous because it's worn out, then it's no longer enforcable.

I don't park illegally, but parking enforcement relies on both the council and the public following the rules. You'd be surprised how some councils (not saying Sheffield here) have tried to pull a fast one on drivers with regards to parking restrictions.

zipzop

03-09-2006, 20:56

mmm interesting..
not sure about that one.

meanwhile, i am interested in becoming a treffic warden, how would I go about this?
:cool:

Big Rod

03-09-2006, 21:54

DSaw a warden in Swallownest for the first time EVER the other day....

What is the world coming to?

Tony

03-09-2006, 22:17

Mod note:

I refer to the chief constable because that is who I was told to refer to by the people who dish out the tickets, which if you could be bothered to analyze my statement , you could have worked out without having to ask. Are you a copper?
I hear you can get in now with a size of 4'10'' and an IQ which is sub 100

dragonsoup, you're heading for another ban. Pack it in please.

Planner1

04-09-2006, 09:35

mmm interesting..
not sure about that one.

meanwhile, i am interested in becoming a treffic warden, how would I go about this?
:cool:

Call Parking Services on 2736158, I'm sure they will be able to advise.

Planner1

04-09-2006, 09:38

If I phone this number what are the chances of getting a warden out on a motorbike or van to issue a ticket to a dangerously parked car?
If so how long would it take?

Maybe I'll give it a go
Theres a van been parked at the bottom of Psalter Lane causing an obstruction on a double yellow all day.........

When the Broomhill scheme starts this week will you be stationing wardens around the schools off Clarkehouse Road?
I see its all now pay and display so there is nowhere to drop off private schoolchildren - I am fascinated to see how this pans out, I imagine (hope) there is a fortune to be made in fines

So, to be blunt, will you routinely station wardens round the private schools at 830am and 330pm?

Please please please :)

As I said, there well be Parking Attendants patroling that area all day, every day.

dragonsoup

05-09-2006, 19:07

unlike you i will not bother with childish insults always a sign someone is losing an argument,but will ask again if you are so intelligent why would you ask a police chief to comment on council policy regardless of what you were allegedly told.
No childish insults then , ok. I didnt ask the police chief anything I was told (by a council worker, or city ambassador in a uniform )that he ' was aware of the situation. Who said it was an argument? you might like to think so I thought it was just a discussion on a web site! I take it you are unacustomed to real arguments and finally , when did I state that I was intelligent?

PatzB

06-09-2006, 08:21

Planner1

06-09-2006, 12:13

what time do parking attendants finish in the evening? Last night about 9 pm on Northumberland road which is part of the new parking scheme there were quite a few cars and vans parked on double yellow lines!!

Contact Parking Services on 2736158 or email parkingservices@sheffield.gov.uk if you want to report a problem. I believe most of them work till 8.30pm, but they can cover later times as necessary. You're best contacting them directly for full information.

PatzB

07-09-2006, 09:33

Well I emailed parking services and got this reply

Parking Attendants dont work after 8.30pm and they start at 8.00am. If there are any problems during that time you can contact our office on 0114 2736255.

So you can park where you want so long as its before 8am or after 8.30pm!

gbeardshaw

26-09-2006, 03:21

Here is a picture for issustration :-

http://images.epilogue.net/users/tonyhough/Mantis1.jpg

I've seen lots of these around hillsborough with yellow and black hats on! You know the ones I'm talking about. They are better known as Parking Wardens.... They Prey on unsuspecting students that go to Hillsborough College!

One of these horrible insects has had hold of our lass, as she started her first day on an Art course at Hillsborough college and got a ticket, Miss Joslyn stlyee for parking on a grass verge .... I wouldn't mind but there is absolutly no parking areas in Hillsborough and there are double yellows everywhere. You get clamped it you park in the dogs .... so whats a student to do???? Take public transport after paying over £5000 in insurance and taxes to get themselves on the road ...... DONT THINK SO!

I'm thinking of contesting this for her and just wondered if anymody has ever contested a parking ticket and won in Sheff.

Thoughts????

Thanks,
Gary.

peterdo

26-09-2006, 05:11

Commit the crime pay the fine. Simple. :D

Don_Kiddick

26-09-2006, 05:55

Can she not walk from the nearest official parking space?

viking

26-09-2006, 06:08

Can she not walk from the nearest official parking space?
She's a student. C'mon.

THEMike

26-09-2006, 06:31

I wouldn't mind but there is absolutly no parking areas in Hillsborough and there are double yellows everywhere. You get clamped it you park in the dogs .... so whats a student to do???? Take public transport after paying over £5000 in insurance and taxes to get themselves on the road ...... DONT THINK SO!

Paying £5000 in insurance and taxes does not buy you the right to park somewhere where it's been decided for whatever reason to restrict parking.

It's probably been restricted for a reason. Take a look round the hallamshire hospital, double-yellow lines everywhere, one tiny carpark, resident only parking on all roads for miles. But all for a reason. Sure it's a pain if you work there or have a relative in there. But it's like that for a reason.

But ownership of a car does not give you the inherent right to drive it and park it anywhere you like. You have to obey the rules of the road.

Park somewhere daft, get a ticket. Simple as that.

Traffic wardens are just doing a job.

KenH

26-09-2006, 07:28

Go on the bus and stop making a fuss.

Halibut

26-09-2006, 07:30

There are car parking spaces in Hillsborough if you look for them. If your girlfriend hasn't the brains or energy to find a legal parking spot and then walk a few hundred yards to College it's rather sad. She should just pay up and park somewhere sensible in future.

Incidentally on what grounds were you hoping to contest the ticket?
Being above the law? Being too idle to look for a legal place to park? Too snotty to use the tram?

KenH

26-09-2006, 07:33

Incidentally on what grounds were you hoping to contest the ticket?
Being above the law? Being too idle to look for a legal place to park? Too snotty to use the tram?

If someone pays £5000 for insurance and taxes to operate a car then I would think they will have a fairly good defence on the basis of diminished responsibility.

Hecate

26-09-2006, 07:41

Tough. She parked illegally (and profoundly inconsiderately) and so deserved a ticket.

I really can't understand folk whinging about getting parking tickets. There are restrictions in place. If you contravene them, and get caught, you get a ticket. If you don't want a ticket, don't park where you shouldn't. It's hardly rocket science.

£5000 for tax and insurance? Good God. If she can afford that, I would have thought she could easily afford to pay the parking fine.

desy

26-09-2006, 07:47

Did not have double yellow lines on the road outside until they built the college. Parked there for years to go to speedway. They could have got away with lines down oneside

martss

26-09-2006, 07:48

£5000 for insurance and tax?! Whats she driving? Welcome to the world of owning a car!

Pay it stop and moaning. Or contest it and tell us how you get on.

sccsux

26-09-2006, 08:15

Take a look round the hallamshire hospital, double-yellow lines everywhere, one tiny carpark, resident only parking on all roads for miles.

But all for a reason.

Yep.

To make as much cash from us people of Sheffield as is possible, for the smallest ammount of work:thumbsup:

THEMike

26-09-2006, 08:22

Yep.

To make as much cash from us people of Sheffield as is possible, for the smallest ammount of work:thumbsup:

hah! And there was me thinking it was because the local residents were unable to park due to people visiting the hospital, and that hospital ambulances were unable to get to the ambulance drop off points because it was all snarled up with cars.

(My wife used to work at the Hallamshire, had two grandparents pass away there and had two babies at Jessops, the parking is a pain, but, anything else would be worse)

garryn

26-09-2006, 09:26

Miss Joslyn stlyee for parking on a grass verge ....

I recently complained about the standards of parking by parents outside school near where I live (Rotherham) to Steetpride (local gov)

The response I got from them said they could attend as regards parking on yellow lines however….
Regarding parking with 2 or more wheels on the pavement. They said this was a hornets nest. They couldn’t enforce it. They said within London you couldn’t park on the pavement unless you were told you could. Outside London you can’t once you’re told you can’t.

The enforcement of this has to be done by police dealing with it as an obstruction.

I don’t know how genuine this info is, it could have been a local government employee trying to pass the buck. But it may be worthwhile looking into.

Thanks for the reminder, I’ve now got to get onto our local police to address my original issue

kimmie

26-09-2006, 10:11

They are all over Broomhill like wasps on a hot summer day in a bin outside the lolly shop! I got one just for nipping into a bank at Broomhill for 2 minutes.
If you want to get away with parking illegally join the throngs of people (dare not say what colour or creed as this is a leftie board) who go to prayers on Friday afternoon near to the Charles Clifford/ Weston Park Hospital/New Jessops area they block peoples drives park on yellow lines and generally do what they like, with not a ticket issued. If you confront the traffic people about this as I did they will state that ' The chief constable is aware of this'
THAT is discrimination.

parking attendants will start to give a ticket to these people but they get in their vehicles and drive off! they will come back later and they have pulled up again, so the circle starts over! what can teh attendants do???
If a ticketr has not come out of the machine when they drive off it will get cancelled!
if you have got a ticket then yes you can contest it, but if you are in the wrong then you aint gunna get nowhere! If you have any questions on parking, then just pm me and i will answer them as fully as i can!

BASICALLY YOU PARK ILLEGALLY YOU ARE GOING TO GET FINED!

END OF STORY!

bean55788

26-09-2006, 14:26

parking attendents make me sick and its as simple as that!!!

Hecate

26-09-2006, 14:28

parking attendents make me sick and its as simple as that!!!
Why do they make you sick?

gbeardshaw

26-09-2006, 16:07

WOW - This has become a busy little Forum hasn't it? ..... Haven't frequented for some time so didn't expect to get flamed so quickly.

BTW ... Anybody know what actually happened to the topic I posted? or was it removed, renamed & integrated for descriptive reasons?

@garryn

- This was actually my main point... It was apparently a restricted road, haven't been and looked yet, maybe should have done that before posting but understood she was parked in a way that was not causing obstruction to either Road users or pedestrians which would have been my main argument. If it is now illegal to park with 2 or more wheels on the Pavement then I'm sure the Parking wardens could get a lot more "easies" by the looking in the right places and where they are needed because traffic can’t pass due to ill parked cars.... for starters, my road where they could ticket around 15 cars in one go!

As regards to £5000 and being stupid for paying this much .... It was maybe a slight over statement but put simply its called debt! and the sole reason why I don't want to pay the fine. The car is a joint venture with Joint insurance but is all in my name so it makes me liable.

After some research it seems that the government made over 400 Mil last year in the UK on parking tickets, they reckon that something like around 50% of these were incorrectly issued but only 0.66% are ever contested. Apparently they don't want you to contest them so if you do there is a good chance you will win.

Maybe the council could put some of that 400 million into building some car parks around Hillsborough and stop just digging roads up at the bottom of Hillsborough, leaving them for about a year, never working on it and causing even more obstructions!

Finally for some others she was actually looking for a pay and display or a multi-storey pay and park car park but non could be found in Hillsborough .... Does anybody know of any near the college?

Thanks.

gbeardshaw

26-09-2006, 16:32

Planner1

26-09-2006, 22:26

Another thing to note and what actually annoyed me the most was that around 10 other students had parked on the same road in the same way so she naturally assumed it was ok to park their. Every single car got a ticket as if the parking attendant had been lying in wait well aware that every single term new students park in the same location as there is no where else to park.

But, you know what they .... assumption is the mother of all **** up's.

From your original post, it appears she was parked on the verge? If there's a yellow line on the road at that point, it applies to the whole of the highway, which includes the verge and the footway.

So what was the parking attendant supposed to do, ignore the row of cars parked illegally? Attendants patrol wide areas, they don't have time or need to lie in wait.

bean55788

26-09-2006, 23:14

well i dunno if its traffic wardens or the council tht make me sick for the simple fact that the council already get enough money of me threw council tax/natinal insurance/student fees etc etc then to come back 2 my car and some scummy lttle attendent wats to smak a ticket on my car tht some how has been produced in the future!(get to my car at 13.09 apparently the attendent had been waiting until 13.15). i mean if the money was used to i dunno, maybe refill the f****ng pot hole in the city then i wouldnt be to bothered but we all no they just rakin the fines so the big cats can get a bonus and the attendents can get a lovely little argos voucher

RANT OVER!!!!!!!

lol thanks for reading!

gbeardshaw

27-09-2006, 00:52

well i dunno if its traffic wardens or the council tht make me sick for the simple fact that the council already get enough money of me threw council tax/natinal insurance/student fees etc etc then to come back 2 my car and some scummy lttle attendent wats to smak a ticket on my car tht some how has been produced in the future!(get to my car at 13.09 apparently the attendent had been waiting until 13.15). i mean if the money was used to i dunno, maybe refill the ******* pot hole in the city then i wouldnt be to bothered but we all no they just rakin the fines so the big cats can get a bonus and the attendents can get a lovely little argos voucher

RANT OVER!!!!!!!

lol thanks for reading!

I totally agree with you position and thoughts on this which is why I was so ****** off! Its just another way of getting money off us.... I'm sure if I left big dirty **** somewhere they didn't want it they would tax that ******* aswell!

gbeardshaw

27-09-2006, 01:07

From your original post, it appears she was parked on the verge? If there's a yellow line on the road at that point, it applies to the whole of the highway, which includes the verge and the footway.

So what was the parking attendant supposed to do, ignore the row of cars parked illegally? Attendants patrol wide areas, they don't have time or need to lie in wait.

Verge - wasn't obstructing anything unless there was little catapillar that wanted to take a **** and couldn't because of the car tire so then informed the parking warden. Besides I don't see any traffic wardens on the residential streets around here where everybody double parks!

As many people on here maybe aware if you work in target driven Job you know exactly where to find your easy numbers or "Cheap Tickets" as it may be in this case. I.e. OOOO My figures are bit low today, Guess what? I know a nice place in Hillsborough where lots of new students park in September because there is **** all parking around Hillsborough. So lets go their and pick on them!

Rant over!

kimmie

27-09-2006, 11:54

Planner1

27-09-2006, 12:21

Verge - wasn't obstructing anything unless there was little catapillar that wanted to take a **** and couldn't because of the car tire so then informed the parking warden. Besides I don't see any traffic wardens on the residential streets around here where everybody double parks!

As many people on here maybe aware if you work in target driven Job you know exactly where to find your easy numbers or "Cheap Tickets" as it may be in this case. I.e. OOOO My figures are bit low today, Guess what? I know a nice place in Hillsborough where lots of new students park in September because there is **** all parking around Hillsborough. So lets go their and pick on them!

Rant over!

That's no excuse, verges aren't provided for parking on, they're an amenity to make the place look better. Parking on them cause a lot of damage and shouldn't be tolerated. If lots of students are parking illegally it is therefore entirely appropriate that the Attendants give attention to that problem.

The Council's Parking Attendants can only enforce where there is actually a waiting restriction of some type. Double parking probably constitutes obstruction, which only the Police can enforce. Many of the residential streets don't have much in the way of waiting restrictions, which is why you won't see the attendants there. However, where there are restrictions they do enforce and I've seen enough comments from people who have received tickets in Hillsborough to know that the attendants do visit that area and hand out penalties to those who transgress.

Improved enforcement contributes to better traffic flows, improved safety and accessibility, so it should be welcomed. When I worked for the Council I received huge numbers of requests for better enforcement, it was only last year when the Council took over responsibility for all on-street enforcement of waiting restrictions that these demands could be fulfilled. Waiting restrictions are there for very good reasons and should be respected. The same goes for the Attendants who do a difficult job often under very trying circumstances, they should be respected and appreciated too.

sccsux

27-09-2006, 12:30

That's no excuse, verges aren't provided for parking on, they're an amenity to make the place look better. Parking on them cause a lot of damage and shouldn't be tolerated.

I thought it would be classed as an obstruction. Which means the (should be on a) ward-ens should have informed the police to move the offending vehicles as obstructions are not the jurisdiction of TWs:mad:

kimmie

27-09-2006, 12:39

the police can only move the vehicles if they are causing obstruction, yes the cars are causing slight obstruction on the verges but it is not dangerous to teh fact that people cannot walk past or drive past, thats why the attendants ticket these people!

gbeardshaw

27-09-2006, 16:44

I give up!

There are obviously lots of people on here who work/have worked for the council and wish to defend them to the hilt. So I'll pay the bloody fine and they can have the money to **** up some more perfectly good roads with!

Do you have shares kimmie?

Tony

27-09-2006, 17:02

Mod note:

gbeardshaw, please pack it in with the bad language. You're obviously eloquent enough to get your point across without it so please don't do it again. I'm getting fed up of editing it out of your posts.

Thanks.

Planner1

27-09-2006, 23:11

I thought it would be classed as an obstruction. Which means the (should be on a) ward-ens should have informed the police to move the offending vehicles as obstructions are not the jurisdiction of TWs:mad:

As I said traffic regulations apply to the whole of the highway, which includes the verge, so the parking attendants will ticket them if they can.

Why don't you stop the petty name calling? It isn't necessary and doesn't help anyone to take you seriously.

bean55788

28-09-2006, 02:30

Excuse Me Everybody! Well Those Who Are Being Very Stupid!
The Attendants Are Just Doing There Jobs, Just Like Most People In Sheffield Who Do Their Jobs!
If People Didnt Park Illegally Then They Wouldnt Get A Ticket Would They??????
And Parking Attendants Dont Get Bonuses Or Little Argos Vouchers For How Many Tickets They Put On They Get Nothing For It!
And They Don't Just Decide To Go Somewhere And Pick On Students, The Parking Services Recieves Complaints About The Parking So They Act Upon These! It Is Not Their Fault That There Is No Parking! Any Driver Should No That They Are Not Aloud To Park On Yellow Lines! So She Should Have Used Her Common Sense Shouldnt She?

What Is Your Problem????

Why Do People Have A Go At The Attendants It Is Not There Fault They Get Told Wher To Go When They Arrive At Work, If They Se Illegally Parked Cars Then Of Course They Are Going To Ticket Them For Goodness Sake!

People Who Complain Are Sad Pathetic Losers Who Want To Get Away With Breaking The Law Well I Got News For You All It All Going To Change, The Attendants Are Coming And Your Going To Have To Pay Up!

you would be suprised at the incentives parking attendents get for doing there jobs and most of us dont fault the parking attendents but if there is such a big problem with people parking illegally and breaking the law obviously the council must be able to come up with some other solution than to give everyone fines! a good example of this would be hillsbrough college when it was built there were ok, parking facilities avalible outside the college but after a couple of complaints alot of students returned to college after the easter break to find the road painted with double yellow lines! i mean whats tht all about? not even no discussions with the people tht actuallly go to the college so there actions were very biosed dont you think? and also im sure a read somewhere that parking around some of the university sites would be changing to pay and display?! so your telling me that this has nothing to do with money grabing?!o and you will find that the majority of people who get parking fines dont actually get them for double yello line parking but for silly things such as parking in an area within a certain time limit

once again rant over

thanks 4 reading lol

Planner1

28-09-2006, 23:21

you would be suprised at the incentives parking attendents get for doing there jobs and most of us dont fault the parking attendents but if there is such a big problem with people parking illegally and breaking the law obviously the council must be able to come up with some other solution than to give everyone fines! a good example of this would be hillsbrough college when it was built there were ok, parking facilities avalible outside the college but after a couple of complaints alot of students returned to college after the easter break to find the road painted with double yellow lines! i mean whats tht all about? not even no discussions with the people tht actuallly go to the college so there actions were very biosed dont you think? and also im sure a read somewhere that parking around some of the university sites would be changing to pay and display?! so your telling me that this has nothing to do with money grabing?!o and you will find that the majority of people who get parking fines dont actually get them for double yello line parking but for silly things such as parking in an area within a certain time limit

once again rant over

thanks 4 reading lol

Do you not think that it is in the nature of people to try to "get away with it" if they can? If people park illegally and get away with it, they continue to do so, other people see that this is happening and join them.

Up until the Council took it over last year, parking enforcement in Sheffield was almost non-existant as the Police had let their traffic warden service run down by natural wastage, because they knew the Council were taking over. The motoring public knew very well that they were very unlikely to get a ticket if they flouted the regulations.

Parking resrictions are there for a very good reason. The threat of enforcement is necessary to make sure the regulations are observed.

As far as consultation on introducing double yellow lines is concerned, the minimum the Council has to do is put one advert in the Star saying they are proposing to do it. In fact they do more, they put up notices on-street and letter drop all directly affected properties (ie those which are going to have the lines outside them). There's always an argument about how widely you should consult, but you have to draw the line somewhere.

The introduction of residents parking zones and pay and display for short stay parking in areas around the hospitals and universities (already introduced in Broomhill and coming to Crookesmoor probably next year) has nothing to do with money grabbing. It's to reduce the impact of commuter parking, give priority back to residents and free up parking spaces for shoppers, visitors and hospital patients. The pay and display is 20p per hour and it is to make the eforcement easier and less labour intensive.

Chumley

28-09-2006, 23:42

gbeardshaw

29-09-2006, 02:18

Do you not think that it is in the nature of people to try to "get away with it" if they can? If people park illegally and get away with it, they continue to do so, other people see that this is happening and join them.

Up until the Council took it over last year, parking enforcement in Sheffield was almost non-existant as the Police had let their traffic warden service run down by natural wastage, because they knew the Council were taking over. The motoring public knew very well that they were very unlikely to get a ticket if they flouted the regulations.

Parking resrictions are there for a very good reason. The threat of enforcement is necessary to make sure the regulations are observed.

As far as consultation on introducing double yellow lines is concerned, the minimum the Council has to do is put one advert in the Star saying they are proposing to do it. In fact they do more, they put up notices on-street and letter drop all directly affected properties (ie those which are going to have the lines outside them). There's always an argument about how widely you should consult, but you have to draw the line somewhere.

The introduction of residents parking zones and pay and display for short stay parking in areas around the hospitals and universities (already introduced in Broomhill and coming to Crookesmoor probably next year) has nothing to do with money grabbing. It's to reduce the impact of commuter parking, give priority back to residents and free up parking spaces for shoppers, visitors and hospital patients. The pay and display is 20p per hour and it is to make the eforcement easier and less labour intensive.

Ok by now I'm guessing you and Kimmie work for Sheffild Council? If so I have some thoughts for you.

1. Less talking more doing, this is my main gripe. You have aknowledged the fact that parking in Sheffield is less than adequate... and as result lots more people are receiveing tickets so......... Why not do something about it now! (not next year!) and get more pay & diplay parking zones and car parks built instead of using the money you earn from parking tickets to dig up more roads that do not require fixing (as the moral goes, why fix something that isn't broken?) Key example is prince of wales earlier this year... It was fine! why dig it up? why not spend the money on other roads that are so bad it breaks your car i.e. the backstreet roads near prince of wales?

2. If an area is worse for wear as far as parking goes why put double yellows everywhere because of few a complaints!!! ? I'm complaining! why not rub them out! No because it generates revenue where people have no where else to park!

@ The Mod, please now note that my postings have less circumvention of the swear filter emcompassing them, consider my dannies slapped!

Thanks.

gbeardshaw

29-09-2006, 02:30

Also Planner1 and Kimmie, as a side note.

Do all new road developments in Sheff have project managers?? If so then the one in charge of managing the development at the bottom of Hillsborough needs firing right now! because he/she has made a sorry affair of the whole development/scheme, its been going on for far too long now! and is causing more obstruction in one the busiest parts of town than a Bowing 747 would crash landing on the M1.

Again, Thanks for reading.

AlquarUK

29-09-2006, 11:20

I got a ticket the other month for parking infront of a dropped kerb. apparently I can't do that even though there was no double yellow (or any other lines of any descrition) etc to warn me of this.!! ******s :(

Cyclone

29-09-2006, 11:37

A dropped kerb indicates a right of access, was it someones driveway you were blocking or a gate to somewhere?

Now if only I could get the parking attendants to ticket the idiots who block my drive (where there is a dropped kerb)...

Kimmie - the Capital Letter Wardens are also coming, you will be fined if you don't stop capitalising every letter, and no one will read your posts! :P

Planner1

29-09-2006, 11:53

Ok by now I'm guessing you and Kimmie work for Sheffild Council? If so I have some thoughts for you.

1. Less talking more doing, this is my main gripe. You have aknowledged the fact that parking in Sheffield is less than adequate... and as result lots more people are receiveing tickets so......... Why not do something about it now! (not next year!) and get more pay & diplay parking zones and car parks built instead of using the money you earn from parking tickets to dig up more roads that do not require fixing (as the moral goes, why fix something that isn't broken?) Key example is prince of wales earlier this year... It was fine! why dig it up? why not spend the money on other roads that are so bad it breaks your car i.e. the backstreet roads near prince of wales?

2. If an area is worse for wear as far as parking goes why put double yellows everywhere because of few a complaints!!! ? I'm complaining! why not rub them out! No because it generates revenue where people have no where else to park!

@ The Mod, please now note that my postings have less circumvention of the swear filter emcompassing them, consider my dannies slapped!

Thanks.

I used to work for Sheffield Council up to a couple of weeks ago. I was a transport planner and was the Council's lead officer for residents parking schemes and many others.

I'd say that parking is becoming a national issue, it's not just in Sheffield. A great deal of the housing stock is quite old and has no off street parking. Car ownership is rising, so parking is becoming an issue all over the city. when there weren't as many cars, people would generally observe the guidance in the highway code about not parking within 10m of a junction, obstructing people's accesses / driveways etc. As competition for spaces increases, so people begin to park in places they really shouldn't.

The Council gets HUGE numbers of complaints about bad parking and requests for residents parking schemes, more waiting restrictions, better enforcement etc. It isn't just a few complaints.

It's easy to say build more car parks. There are a couple of problems with that. Where do we build them and how do we pay for it? City centre development sites are worth huge amounts and people want to build offices and flats on them because that is what makes them money. The Council doesn't own these sites and doesn't have the money to buy them and build car parks on them. Wherever possible, when a site is cleared pending a development, the Council rents it form the developer for use as a car park until the site is required. Many of the surface level car parks in the city centre are in this category.

It is very difficult to find sites for car parks in residential areas, the Council does what it can with the sites it owns (they are converting a disused depot on Speooner Road, Broomhill into a small car park), but here aren't many people who want the Council to demolish their houses so they can build car parks!

The Council are introducing residents parking schemes in a circle around the city centre to form a peripheral parking zone (PPZ). This is in an effort to combat the effects of commuter parking by limiting the availability of free all-day parking spaces. The permit schemes give back priority to residents who are suffering great difficulties at the moment. Doing this can also be beneficial for local shops and businesses as short stay parking bays are introduced, with pay & display to encourage turnover of spaces and help with enforcement.

The recently introduced scheme in Broomhill appears to be working well, there are now spaces available for residents and visitors and I've seen a couple of reports from traders saying they are finding business is better as their customers can now find somewhere to park, where before, they struggled to find parking space.

I can honestly say that in introducing these schemes, making money out of parking fines was never considered as a motivating factor. The Council are trying ther best to respond to local needs and cut congestion by encouraging commuters to come by more sustainable means.

When introducing area wide schemes the Council will bring the waiting restrictions up to current standards and stop people parking where it is inappropriate to do so. Parking at junctions causes danger for all road users and restricts the ability of larger vehicles to enter some roads. As I said, the Council gets huge numbers of complaints about inappropriate parking, but the only way they can do anything about it is if there is a waiting restriction.

Planner1

29-09-2006, 11:55

Cyclone

29-09-2006, 11:56

gbeardshaw

30-09-2006, 02:24

I used to work for Sheffield Council up to a couple of weeks ago. I was a transport planner and was the Council's lead officer for residents parking schemes and many others.

I'd say that parking is becoming a national issue, it's not just in Sheffield. A great deal of the housing stock is quite old and has no off street parking. Car ownership is rising, so parking is becoming an issue all over the city. when there weren't as many cars, people would generally observe the guidance in the highway code about not parking within 10m of a junction, obstructing people's accesses / driveways etc. As competition for spaces increases, so people begin to park in places they really shouldn't.

The Council gets HUGE numbers of complaints about bad parking and requests for residents parking schemes, more waiting restrictions, better enforcement etc. It isn't just a few complaints.

It's easy to say build more car parks. There are a couple of problems with that. Where do we build them and how do we pay for it? City centre development sites are worth huge amounts and people want to build offices and flats on them because that is what makes them money. The Council doesn't own these sites and doesn't have the money to buy them and build car parks on them. Wherever possible, when a site is cleared pending a development, the Council rents it form the developer for use as a car park until the site is required. Many of the surface level car parks in the city centre are in this category.

It is very difficult to find sites for car parks in residential areas, the Council does what it can with the sites it owns (they are converting a disused depot on Speooner Road, Broomhill into a small car park), but here aren't many people who want the Council to demolish their houses so they can build car parks!

The Council are introducing residents parking schemes in a circle around the city centre to form a peripheral parking zone (PPZ). This is in an effort to combat the effects of commuter parking by limiting the availability of free all-day parking spaces. The permit schemes give back priority to residents who are suffering great difficulties at the moment. Doing this can also be beneficial for local shops and businesses as short stay parking bays are introduced, with pay & display to encourage turnover of spaces and help with enforcement.

The recently introduced scheme in Broomhill appears to be working well, there are now spaces available for residents and visitors and I've seen a couple of reports from traders saying they are finding business is better as their customers can now find somewhere to park, where before, they struggled to find parking space.

I can honestly say that in introducing these schemes, making money out of parking fines was never considered as a motivating factor. The Council are trying ther best to respond to local needs and cut congestion by encouraging commuters to come by more sustainable means.

When introducing area wide schemes the Council will bring the waiting restrictions up to current standards and stop people parking where it is inappropriate to do so. Parking at junctions causes danger for all road users and restricts the ability of larger vehicles to enter some roads. As I said, the Council gets huge numbers of complaints about inappropriate parking, but the only way they can do anything about it is if there is a waiting restriction.

Thankyou for the very informative post, I can appreciate that when you have worked for a said "company" you know all the facts and it can be difficult for an onlooker to grasp these. Thanks for laying it out to me but I'm stuggling to see the general increase in petty ticketing .... as I see it, I'll read it again when I am sober and will probable understand more then.

Thanks,
Gary.

gbeardshaw

30-09-2006, 02:32

I don't know the location, you'll have to be more specific. Which roads?

Just below west bar police station there is the small round about... this follows into sheffield down the side of the crown court and towards park square roundabout. The other side goes into Hillsborugh towards the long stretch towards the college where the most disruption is. This peice of road has been in the air for at least 11 months now and does cause quite a lot of congestion during rush hour. Its the roundabout near the corporation night club ... I think! .. Near the new Business "Velocity" Sheffield building.

scentral

30-09-2006, 06:46

Well I think it's time those nasty wardens got off motorists backs. Every motorist I've ever talked to...
"Was only there 30 seconds" or
"I was only overhanging the double-yellows by half an inch" or
"I didn't notice the (ten metre long) bust stop, yellow lines" etc. etc. etc.

Cyclone

30-09-2006, 09:08

Just below west bar police station there is the small round about... this follows into sheffield down the side of the crown court and towards park square roundabout. The other side goes into Hillsborugh towards the long stretch towards the college where the most disruption is. This peice of road has been in the air for at least 11 months now and does cause quite a lot of congestion during rush hour. Its the roundabout near the corporation night club ... I think! .. Near the new Business "Velocity" Sheffield building.

You're talking about the roadworks for the inner ring road. They are going to be going on for quite a lot longer, and there does/did seem to be an attempt to disrupt traffic as much as possible whilst very little work was done.
This seems to have changed recently and work is progressing, although the closure of roads and reduction to one lane in places does cause some problems.
I'm not quite sure if it's shalesmoor or corporation street that you think is the bigger problem.

Tony

30-09-2006, 09:17

You're talking about the roadworks for the inner ring road. They are going to be going on for quite a lot longer
I heard the other day that it's due for completion in a month or so. Perhaps there is light at the end of this particularly frustrating tunnel. :)

Tony

30-09-2006, 09:20

Update: Check out the Councils ring road website (http://www.sheffield.gov.uk/index.asp?pgid=87773). There are a bunch of progress photos on there that are quite interesting (to somebody like me ;))

Ousetunes

30-09-2006, 09:59

kimmie

30-09-2006, 09:59

Firstly no i don't have shares, my mum works as a parking attendants. and no i am not saying yea lets go fine everyone for stupid reasons.
If you are parked illegally then you are going to get fiend i mean come on lets face it.
Double yellow lines and certain times to park places and etc are there for a reason why can't you just stick to the rules??? What is the problem?
When you learn to drive you also learn where you can park and where you cannot park why don't you people do it now! I just don't understand what the fuss is about! If your girlfriend hadn't parked there in the first place then she wouldn't have got a ticket would she? there is a car park in hillsborough about 5/10 minutes walk from the college what is wrong with parking in there?

Yea sorry about the capitals i got a bit carried away lol :hihi:

kimmie

30-09-2006, 10:03

A question for Planner1 :

When are you going to start enforcing the double yellows at the top of London Road?

This is on the brow of a hill, with a staggered crossroads and a pelican crossing. I can hardly think of a worse place to park illegaly, yet the takeaway drivers seem to do it with impunity.

If you can't stop them parking, couldn't you at least ask your planning colleagues not to be so stupid as to allow people to operate a food delivery business from high street premises with no parking?

the attendants do try to enfoce these areas, but like i have said somewhere else, they drive off before the ticket is issued, then they will come back and be parked there again, it is just a viscious circle with these people! if you drive off before the ticket is issued then you have got away with it!

Ousetunes

30-09-2006, 10:08

kimmie - I agree, hun.

It's these inconsiderate buffoons who create gridlock with their parking, a consequence of their sheer laziness (or more likely, not knowing the Highway Code). Get 'em shifted and we can get on our way (although we still have to contend with traffic lights every 20 yards).

I just wish there were Bus Lane attendants, there to issue fines for plonkers who don't use bus lanes when you're actually allowed to (Crookesvalley Road, city bound, every Saturday morning. No cars parked yet every single car uses the middle lane).

After that, let's have Mobile Phone At The Wheel Attendants, but ensure the fine is more than the £30 fine issued for illegal parking. £500 would be a start.

Rant over (for now).

Cyclone

30-09-2006, 11:02

I heard the other day that it's due for completion in a month or so. Perhaps there is light at the end of this particularly frustrating tunnel. :)
that would be good news, but it would be way ahead of schedule. The plan says 2.5 years from Nov 04, which would be roughly may 07 for completion on time.

Fingers x'd.

I think that the ring road could actually reduce congestion significantly, most people driving through town from parksquare to penistone road have no desire or need to actually be in the city, a bypass would be ideal for getting around the city.

Tony

30-09-2006, 11:35

Ah, it may only be part of it then. The stretch from Shalesmoor to Corporation St looks nearly there but appearances can be deceptive on building sites.

A bit of digging around on the net gives us this (http://www.cbrd.co.uk/futures/bypass/a61.shtml):

Scheme Outline
Creation of a new dual two-lane route around the centre of Sheffield, partly on a new alignment and partly by widening existing roads. The new route is effectively an inner ring road, and is intended to largely replace the abandoned 1960s attempt at an inner ring that was disruptive and caused a great deal of severance. The new road is at-grade and features extensive landscaping.

Stage 1 of the new road has already been completed and current works (detailed on this page) comprise Stage 2.

An anonymous contributor informs us that the plan for completing each section is as follows:

May 2006: Russell Street to Corporation Street via part of the new Corporation Street Gyratory
September 2006: Shalesmoor roundabout; Shalesmoor (to Gibraltar Street) in both directions
February 2007: Corporation Street in both directions
July 2007: new links to Savile Street and Sheffield Parkway

Project Statistics
Cost £23m
Finance Sheffield City Council/Central Government
Estimated duration of works 2004-2007
Length of new road 1 mile

max

30-09-2006, 11:39

Project Statistics
Cost £23m
Finance Sheffield City Council/Central Government
Estimated duration of works 2004-2007
Length of new road 1 mile [/I][/COLOR]

Not bad for an anti-car city/government, what? :D

Greybeard

30-09-2006, 12:31

Not bad for an anti-car city/government, what? :D

That depends on how much easier the scheme makes it for people to get their cars close enough for city centre shopping. Are there any plans for a low-cost park-n-ride bus shuttle service from anywhere on this new ring road to the shopping areas to be developed in the centre, - the Moor, NRQ etc. ?

I don't think there's any room for complacency until we see what the council intend to do with the routes that will be relieved by this scheme ;)

The photos on the council website are quite interesting but wouldn't aerial photos give a much better overview of how the scheme is progressing ?

Planner1

30-09-2006, 22:54

The Ring Road won't help the flow of traffic a great deal.

Every motorist knows our council has an obsession with poorly programmed traffic lights and you'll not be able to travel 20 yards without encountering another set of lights.

(A fine example of incredibly poor programming can be seen at Somerfield Street/Ecclesall Road and the junction between Somerfield Street/Cemetery Road. These two sets of lights create a totally unncessary tailback (ie, a result for our car hating council).

As for the parking attendants, I actually support them. Along Barber Road (where I work) they give motorists a chance to move their vehicle before issuing them with a fine. What I did find strange was that their own vehicle parked on double yellow lines outside our shop on one occasion.

When I mentioned to the bloke at the wheel 'You can't park there, you're on double yellow lines', his rather strange answer was 'Well, where do you expect me to park!'

They're as lazy as the rest of us!

Poorly programmed traffic lights? Having worked for 17 years in Urban Traffic Control, trying to keep the traffic moving as well as possible, I think I'm well qualified to tell you that you're talking absolute rubbish. The guys in UTC do everything they can to make the traffic move as quickly and smoothly as possible.

Queues occur because there are too many vehicles trying to use the roads at peak times. If UTC weren't there to optimise the way the traffic signals work, things would be much, much worse.

Planner1

30-09-2006, 23:01

encouraging commuters

That's the sort of encouragement you get in some countries to vote for the correct party that involves your door being kicked down in the night and a gun pushed into your face.

They are being coerced not encouraged, at least be honest about it.
(not that i'm saying you are threatening people into altering their habits, you are just punishing them if they don't).

People will never get out of their cars unless things get more difficult for them. It's called demand management. Parking restrictions are one of the measures in the toolbox.

Cyclone

01-10-2006, 08:52

People will never get out of their cars unless things get more difficult for them. It's called demand management. Parking restrictions are one of the measures in the toolbox.
I understand that, but when you're talking about the stick, don't pretend that it's orange and donkeys like to eat it, it's disengenius.

Cyclone

01-10-2006, 08:53

That depends on how much easier the scheme makes it for people to get their cars close enough for city centre shopping. Are there any plans for a low-cost park-n-ride bus shuttle service from anywhere on this new ring road to the shopping areas to be developed in the centre, - the Moor, NRQ etc. ?

I don't think there's any room for complacency until we see what the council intend to do with the routes that will be relieved by this scheme ;)

The photos on the council website are quite interesting but wouldn't aerial photos give a much better overview of how the scheme is progressing ?

It's not supposed to make it easier for anyone to get closer to the city centre, it's supposed to make it easier to get from one side of the city to the other without going through the city centre.

Cyclone

01-10-2006, 08:54

Not bad for an anti-car city/government, what? :D

it helps get cars out of the city centre, it must be a councilors wet dream. And (I could be wrong about this) but isn't most of the money coming from elsewhere?

Tony

01-10-2006, 13:53

I have to say that in all my 20 years experience of dealing with Planners, Highways and Councillors in Sheffield I've never drawn the conclusion that they as a body are "anti-car".

However, I have drawn the conclusion that the average man in the street doesn't have a grasp of the issues involved and often gets the wrong end of the stick as a result. Increased consultation liaison with the public is welcomed and I do hope that they carry on the good work that Planner1 has been doing here. A few more departments should take the hint. ;)

sccsux

01-10-2006, 14:10

Tony

01-10-2006, 14:13

It's not anti car. It's facing reality.
However, I have drawn the conclusion that the average man in the street doesn't have a grasp of the issues involved and often gets the wrong end of the stick as a result.

sccsux

01-10-2006, 14:29

It's not anti car. It's facing reality.

Bullying people is not the way forward. Incentives would be a better approach.

Tony

01-10-2006, 14:52

I can only respond by quoting myself for the second time.
However, I have drawn the conclusion that the average man in the street doesn't have a grasp of the issues involved and often gets the wrong end of the stick as a result.

If you have a think about the many wider issues you could say that there is an incentive to improve your fitness, or to reduce carbon emissions, or to reduce congestion, or to improve public transport through increased use, or to reduce the cost of travel, etc, etc. All of these things are incentives to use your car less.

Or were you thinking about handing out fiver's to drivers?

pqrsteve

01-10-2006, 16:45

If people behaved responsibly in the first place we wouldnt have need for these laws. Laws are only there for irresponsible people. Its bad getting a ticket but the way round it is not to flout the law.

Anyway, would anyone like to confirm this point for me? I believe that the ticket has to actually be put on the car before it is valid. I hope so anyway because the other day when i was irresponsibly parked too long in a residents parking area, (shame on me) i came back to the car to find one of these cheery souls making out a ticket. I asked her if she might change her mind if i got on my knees and begged. " sorry sir i have already made it out" This is baloney since i know they can be cancelled. Well i remembered the aforesaid bit of wisdom so i got in the car and drove off not leaving her time to afix the penalty notice to the window.

I have my fingers crossed but its over 2 weeks now and no fine.

:)

gbeardshaw

02-10-2006, 04:13

Cyclone

02-10-2006, 06:38

Ousetunes

02-10-2006, 09:19

Poorly programmed traffic lights? Having worked for 17 years in Urban Traffic Control, trying to keep the traffic moving as well as possible, I think I'm well qualified to tell you that you're talking absolute rubbish. The guys in UTC do everything they can to make the traffic move as quickly and smoothly as possible.

Queues occur because there are too many vehicles trying to use the roads at peak times. If UTC weren't there to optimise the way the traffic signals work, things would be much, much worse.

Is it April already?

Maybe if you'd not cocked the road system up so much, with endless, pointless, pedestrian-favoured lights and blocked every side street off then we could get to where we wanted. (You call it rat-running.)

I could list sets of lights that remain on red far longer than necessary.

Cath

02-10-2006, 10:46

Is it April already?

Maybe if you'd not cocked the road system up so much, with endless, pointless, pedestrian-favoured lights and blocked every side street off then we could get to where we wanted. (You call it rat-running.)

I could list sets of lights that remain on red far longer than necessary.
Spot on. Tried exiting Brook Hill roundabout w.o being stopped by pedestrian lights? If there's more than 2 cars trying to get off the same exit the 3rd one is left obstructing the roundabout.

People will never get out of their cars unless things get more difficult for them. It's called demand management. Parking restrictions are one of the measures in the toolbox.
This is erroneous. There is no evidence to suggest that car drivers can only take so much bullying and inconvenience and that eventually they will give up their cars and take to public transport. All they will do is dig in deeper and get more hacked off. Businesses will move out.

Magilla

02-10-2006, 10:53

I can assure you that any tickets issued are enforceable through the courts - and the City Council does follow up on tickets.

Are they? That remains to be seen, they don't fully comply with the 1991 Road Traffic Act by not containing a date of contravention, the date of issue does not have to be the same date.

I suspect that if someone used this defence in court, there's a very real chance the council would lose. If they did lose, they'd have to pay back all the money from tickets since the system started.

Planner1

02-10-2006, 12:22

Spot on. Tried exiting Brook Hill roundabout w.o being stopped by pedestrian lights? If there's more than 2 cars trying to get off the same exit the 3rd one is left obstructing the roundabout.

This is erroneous. There is no evidence to suggest that car drivers can only take so much bullying and inconvenience and that eventually they will give up their cars and take to public transport. All they will do is dig in deeper and get more hacked off. Businesses will move out.

The Council are well aware of the operational deficiencies of Brook Hill Roundabout. It was put in 20 years ago when traffic levels were somewhat lighter. It's being looked at as part of the South Yorkshire Inteligent Transport System. Park square type signal arrangements are veing considered for a number of the roundabouts on the ring road.

No, actually, you're wrong. London's congestion charge has reduced vehicular traffic in the centre and public transport usage is up.

Car ownership and usage is growing, the highway network can't cope at peak times, the peaks spread, congestion increases and parking problems blight whole areas. It isn't possible to build our way out of the problem. Still, drivers will not give up their cars, so measures have to be introduced which will oblige them to consider their alternatives. The way Sheffield are approaching this is to try to discourage commuters from bringing their cars into the city centre and the areas immediately around it by restricting the amount of all-day parking spaces.

Cyclone

02-10-2006, 12:25

and by increasing congestion through road closures and restrictions.

Planner1

02-10-2006, 12:35

Is it April already?

Maybe if you'd not cocked the road system up so much, with endless, pointless, pedestrian-favoured lights and blocked every side street off then we could get to where we wanted. (You call it rat-running.)

I could list sets of lights that remain on red far longer than necessary.

I don't think the pedestrians will agree with you on this one. The Council has to consider all road users, especially the most vulnerable categories, which include pedestrians. we can't expect more people to walk if they can't cross the road.

Many of the road closures are done in the interests of maintaining capacity, by reducing turns and conflicts. Most towns and cities employ the same tactics.

You're obviously looking at the traffic signal issue from the point of getting maximum throughput of vehicles at all times. That isn't the only objective. There are many more factors which come into play. In setting up signal timing plans it's necessary to look at the wider picture across the network. At peak times, it is inevitable that queues will occur. To effectively manage the network, these queues must be managed and only allowed to build where they cause the least overall harm to network efficiency. Someties you may be held at red, but can't see why. There will be a good reason.

Planner1

02-10-2006, 12:36

and by increasing congestion through road closures and restrictions.

As I've said, most of them are done in the interest of improving capacity and reducing congestion.

metalman

02-10-2006, 12:52

I don't think the pedestrians will agree with you on this one. The Council has to consider all road users, especially the most vulnerable categories, which include pedestrians. we can't expect more people to walk if they can't cross the road.

But is there any evidence that people are put off walking by the fact that they can't cross the road? Probably not... but the council still persists in doing things like the total mess they're making at the end of Sandygate Road in Crosspool in the name of pedestrians.

Planner1

02-10-2006, 22:12

But is there any evidence that people are put off walking by the fact that they can't cross the road? Probably not... but the council still persists in doing things like the total mess they're making at the end of Sandygate Road in Crosspool in the name of pedestrians.

Not put off walking because they can't get across a road? Are you real? There's ample evidence that improving the pedestrian environment, providing safe, attractive, walkable routes leads to increases in the level of walking. I suppose you want the Council to put in pedestrian underpasses and overbridges so the poor car drivers won't be inconvenienced! It's not the 1960's anymore, times have changed, and for the better too.

So, got our crystal ball out have we? How do you know Sandygate Road / Manchester Road is a mess, it isn't finished yet???? As it happens I was heavily involved in that scheme. We did a lot of consultation and worked closely with local community and business groups to find a scheme they were happy with. They brought forward their own ideas and most of them have gone into the final scheme. The scheme that's going in is producing a lot of benefits for the local community that they would never have got if the Council hadn't come along with proposals for the S10 bus quality corridor and actually listened to what the local people were telling them. The road is being narrowed on the entrance to Sandygate Road because drivers come around there too fast. The local people told us this and asked us to do something about it. I think the scheme which is being installed is a very good one and I believe that most of the local people agree. The Council went the extra mile and the people of Crosspool appreciated it.

metalman

03-10-2006, 08:23

Cyclone

03-10-2006, 08:36

Not put off walking because they can't get across a road? Are you real? There's ample evidence that improving the pedestrian environment, providing safe, attractive, walkable routes leads to increases in the level of walking. I suppose you want the Council to put in pedestrian underpasses and overbridges so the poor car drivers won't be inconvenienced! It's not the 1960's anymore, times have changed, and for the better too.

For the better... I suspect that most motorists (and that equates to most voting adults) would disagree.
If you can't put in pedestrian over/underpasses, because god forbid that we'd have to make an effort to cross a road, how about car under/over passes. Probably too much effort though isn't it, you'd rather just screw over the traffic flow for the sake of people walking.

There won't be many people walking around the city centre once all the businesses have died due to the inability to drive to them, and once no one can even get to the centre to park up and then walk around.

So, got our crystal ball out have we? How do you know Sandygate Road / Manchester Road is a mess, it isn't finished yet???? As it happens I was heavily involved in that scheme. We did a lot of consultation and worked closely with local community and business groups to find a scheme they were happy with. They brought forward their own ideas and most of them have gone into the final scheme. The scheme that's going in is producing a lot of benefits for the local community that they would never have got if the Council hadn't come along with proposals for the S10 bus quality corridor and actually listened to what the local people were telling them. The road is being narrowed on the entrance to Sandygate Road because drivers come around there too fast. The local people told us this and asked us to do something about it. I think the scheme which is being installed is a very good one and I believe that most of the local people agree. The Council went the extra mile and the people of Crosspool appreciated it.

Ousetunes

03-10-2006, 09:02

Just been into Broomhill and found that one of the machines is not working.

What are my rights when such a machine is not working? Am I supposed to walk until I find one that's in operation or what?

And for all they cost, surely the council could have installed machines which give change.

Then you wonder why we reckon they're another fleece-the-motorist money making con.

metalman

03-10-2006, 09:47

If you can't put in pedestrian over/underpasses, because god forbid that we'd have to make an effort to cross a road, how about car under/over passes. Probably too much effort though isn't it, you'd rather just screw over the traffic flow for the sake of people walking.

Just for the record, I'm not against pedestrian crossings, it's obvious that people need to cross the road, that's fine. And I certainly don't want to return to the days of underpasses occupied by beggars and muggers either. I just don't see why all the roads have to be narrowed as well.

Planner1

03-10-2006, 11:29

Strange because from what I've heard, everyone in Crosspool was dead against it. Any Crosspoolians care to contribute on the matter? Why oh why oh why for example did you have to narrow the end of Watt Lane so that now there isn't room for a car to go into it at the same time as one is coming out?

I do a lot of walking and I must say that among the things that put me off doing it, the width of the road I have to cross is very low down the list - behind things like it's hard work up all the hills, you get soaked when it's pouring down, you can't carry anything heavy or bulky if you buy it, you get accosted by clipboard people/alcoholics/beggars/general undesirables at every step, and so on.

Watt Lane is another place where the road was very wide and pedestrains had difficulty crossing. The Council are putting in a zebra crossing and the road is being narrowed, two way traffic will be able to pass, but more slowly.

You may be able bodied and be able to walk quickly, many people can't and the Council has to take their needs into account. On crossings, narrowing the width of theroad can actually cut delays to motorists as the pedestrians don't have as far to cross and therefore get out of the way quicker!

When the proposals were first consulted upon, some people in Crosspool were against them. They formed a group, Crosspool Traffic Campaign (CTC) to press their views. We engaged with them and the local Forum to revise the plans and come up with a final scheme which would give the bus related benefits that we wanted, whilst giving the community some things they wanted. There were several well attended public meetings along with letter drops and formal consultation. When the final scheme was approved, even the most die-hard opponent of the proposals would concede that the Council had listened to local people and acted on their concerns.

The Crosspool scheme has something for everyone. Motorists will benefit from better parking facilities in Crosspool Centre and the junction of Sandygate Road adn Manchester Road is being remodelled such that right and left turning traffic will be able to exit Sandygate Road simultaneously more easily and the operation of the adjacent pedestrian crossing on Manchester Road is being adjusted to create more gaps in the main road traffic so that Sandygate Road traffic can get out more easily, avoiding queuing in the morning peak hour.

scentral

03-10-2006, 11:51

All that this scheme will achieve is:

a) Lots of tactile (knobbly) paving for the elderly to trip over
b) The usual plethora of yellow lines which the vast majority of motorists have always ignored
c) New bus stop layouts (see b))
d) Employees of the shops parking in the spaces all day.

BTW, is it 2 O'clock yet? If so, StreetFarce will have knocked off for the day :)

metalman

03-10-2006, 12:18

Motorists will benefit from better parking facilities in Crosspool Centre and the junction of Sandygate Road adn Manchester Road is being remodelled such that right and left turning traffic will be able to exit Sandygate Road simultaneously more easily and the operation of the adjacent pedestrian crossing on Manchester Road is being adjusted to create more gaps in the main road traffic so that Sandygate Road traffic can get out more easily, avoiding queuing in the morning peak hour.

Does that mean that the end part of Sandygate Road is going to be one way coming out onto Manchester Road then? Otherwise I don't see how you're going to get three lanes of traffic in there while narrowing the road as well.

sccsux

03-10-2006, 12:39

Otherwise I don't see how you're going to get three lanes of traffic in there while narrowing the road as well.

Three cycle lanes?:hihi:.

Tis going to be fun when it's finished:rolleyes:

Magilla

03-10-2006, 12:52

The way Sheffield are approaching this is to try to discourage commuters from bringing their cars into the city centre and the areas immediately around it by restricting the amount of all-day parking spaces.

It's actually cheaper to own and run a modest car in Sheffield over the busses, their pricing is ridiculous.

So restricting parking will only penalise the very people who can't afford it, secretaries, cleaners, part timers and people who're generally on low income. People who have better/higher paying jobs (tho not strictly more worthwhile) tend to have parking provided, thus are unaffected.

You have to wonder if there's some form of cartel in operation, as you're forced off the roads onto the only other option, public transport, that costs more to use than to own a car! Any councillors have shares in First?

Magilla

03-10-2006, 12:56

and by increasing congestion through road closures and restrictions.

I agree with Cyclone.

Should the council wish to introduce congestion charges, how are they going swing this counter arguement? Congestion *has* been artificially increased by the planning in the city centre.

sccsux

03-10-2006, 12:59

Congestion *has* been artificially increased by the planning in the city centre.

It has been mentioned:D.

Probably true.

Planner1

03-10-2006, 21:04

Planner1

03-10-2006, 21:06

Does that mean that the end part of Sandygate Road is going to be one way coming out onto Manchester Road then? Otherwise I don't see how you're going to get three lanes of traffic in there while narrowing the road as well.

The junction was very wide. Moving the centre island slightly does the job. 2 cars could just about squeeze out side by side before.

Ousetunes

04-10-2006, 08:52

Magilla

04-10-2006, 10:49

Planner1 - you haven't told me yet why the new pay and display machines in Broomhill weren't designed/programmed to give the motorist change. For, what was it, something like £1,500 apiece, I'd expect a machine to be capable of doing that.

If it wasn't there to fleece the motorist, that is. (Oh dear, I've only got a pound coin for a 20p fee.)

Yes, I'd like to know the answer to this aswell.

sccsux

04-10-2006, 10:56

Planner1 - you haven't told me yet why the new pay and display machines in Broomhill weren't designed/programmed to give the motorist change.

I don't suppose you noticed if the metres accept payment in two pence coins (ie 10 2ps) at all?

Planner1

04-10-2006, 23:31

Yes, I'd like to know the answer to this aswell.

You'll have to ask Parking Services that one. They picked the machines, that wasn't part of my remit: parkingservices@sheffield.gov.uk <parkingservices@sheffield.gov.uk>

scentral

05-10-2006, 08:07

Planner1

05-10-2006, 12:16

Hi Planner1.
You state that the tactile paving is "National Standard" and I'm sure it is. But does this make it a good idea ?(let's face it, some of the people who dream these things up need to fill their day somehow)
My thoughts on this are, they are undoubtedly an uncomfortable experience for those unsteady on their feet. They seem to get inordinately icy in cold weather but the main point is this:
Given the number of blind people about (extremely small), isn't this massive provision of "crossing points" way OTT? Also, having located them I'm certain that a blind person couldn't just set off across a road. They'd surely ask a passer-by for assistance who could give info where it is safe to cross without special paving.
Finally, even if guide dogs are "trained" to look left, right and left again, the speed of traffic on, for example the upper reaches of Sandygate Road would challenge a 100m sprinter.
Not out to cause controversy, just think this is a totally wrong way to address a problem that was probably very small in the first place.

The Government set the national standard after consultation with disability groups. Part of Government's agenda is to improve accessibility for all sections of society, which is surely a good thing.

Most of the people who are "blind" are actually partially sighted and there are more than you might think. They can differentiate colours, hence uncontrolled crossings get buff paving and controlled ones get red. At controlled crossings, the layout of the paving guides the blind person to the right hand push button unit, which has (on most modern signal insallations) a small rotating tactile button situated on the bottom of the push button unit. The button turns when the green man is illuminated.

The Government has lots of performance indicators and targets for Local Government. The only one for traffic signals is how many sites have full facilities for the disabled. If an Authority is seen as under-performing, funding will be cut.

The uncontrolled crossing points help lots of people to get around more easily, parents with pushchairs, wheelchair users, others with mobility difficulties etc. You'd be surprised how many requests the Council gets to provide them.

Magilla

05-10-2006, 14:22

Are they? That remains to be seen, they don't fully comply with the 1991 Road Traffic Act by not containing a date of contravention, the date of issue does not have to be the same date.

I suspect that if someone used this defence in court, there's a very real chance the council would lose. If they did lose, they'd have to pay back all the money from tickets since the system started.

If you have paid you can ask for it back....

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=14762

Foggy Eyes

05-10-2006, 16:06

It's actually cheaper to own and run a modest car in Sheffield over the busses, their pricing is ridiculous.

So restricting parking will only penalise the very people who can't afford it, secretaries, cleaners, part timers and people who're generally on low income. People who have better/higher paying jobs (tho not strictly more worthwhile) tend to have parking provided, thus are unaffected.

You have to wonder if there's some form of cartel in operation, as you're forced off the roads onto the only other option, public transport, that costs more to use than to own a car! Any councillors have shares in First?

So you can run a car for £750 can you.....that's the price of a yearly travelmaster allowing travel on all buses, trams and trains in south yorkshire. a sheffield one is £665.

even the worst car will cost at least that, once insurance, petrol, tax, servicing, depreciation, parking charges is taken into account.

Magilla

05-10-2006, 16:50

So you can run a car for £750 can you.....that's the price of a yearly travelmaster allowing travel on all buses, trams and trains in south yorkshire. a sheffield one is £665.

even the worst car will cost at least that, once insurance, petrol, tax, servicing, depreciation, parking charges is taken into account.

Well 750 would certainly more than cover the cost of the petrol and insurance for the journey I do each day over a year, I don't pay parking and the car depreciates whether I use it or not (if it's possible to go any lower), but I take your point.

Cyclone

05-10-2006, 17:04

hands up anyone who never drives out of south yorkshire.

Foggy Eyes

05-10-2006, 17:39

Well 750 would certainly more than cover the cost of the petrol and insurance for the journey I do each day over a year, I don't pay parking and the car depreciates whether I use it or not (if it's possible to go any lower), but I take your point.
i think you are in the minority, most people don't have a clue how much their car costs to run.....

the yearly ticket is good value, but i wouldn't spend £750 in one go. the fact is that these better value tickets are hard to get hold of (requires a visit to a travel info centre), and require a lot of cash at once. it's the rip off single tickets that are the problem. barber road to west street is £1.20!

no wonder people like yourselves travel by car......that's not criticism by the way.

to be perfectly honest, i'm a bus user (no car) and although on the whole they work well, i do get fed up with it sometimes. just recently services have been much worse, probably due to the huge influx of students getting on and off, asking the bus driver questions etc. the west street bus gate, which over the summer works fine (after school holidays but before uni term) is now a shambles, with massive queues delaying buses and trams.

Cyclone

05-10-2006, 18:15

justwicked

05-10-2006, 19:28

God damn money grabbers... And with uprated charges for resident permits? Scum bags.

Titian

07-10-2006, 09:04

Longcol

07-10-2006, 09:20

Lovely, absolutely delightful to drive through Broomhill this morning and encounter so little congestion.

Thanks to the traffic lights at the Whitham Road/Crookes Road/Nile Street being out that is.

Just think how great it would be if we switched all these unnecessary lights off (with the odd exception of course).

What time was that - I use that junction daily coming down Crookes at around 8:45 am - the number of times it get's blocked by traffic from Ranmoor / Fulwood who will happily pull on to the junction without being able to clear it is incredible - it's getting to the point that traffic from Crookes is only able to cross on every other green light - take away the lights and I don't think traffic from Crookes would ever be able to cross the junction at busy times given the selfish attitudes of many drivers approaching from Fulwood Road.

Oh and by the way, I can't remember a parking meter anywhere in the country (or France and Spain for that matter) that gives change.

gbeardshaw

07-10-2006, 18:25

I've just had an interesting charge.

I was delivering a large tv to some "supported" flats and parked in the flats car park to do so. I got a parking ticket so wrote to them within the specified time explaining.

Today I got a reply (2 months later) and the charge has increased to £120 due to them not responding to me earlier. They also have my car registration wrong on the letter. :confused:

Do some research, if you contest a ticket they have to give you the initial 28 days reduced charge again starting from the date they throw it out. I would write back informing them of this.

Deepak_S7

10-02-2007, 15:45

For the first time EVER I have seen wardens slapping dozens and dozens of tickets around Bramall Lane this afternoon.

This is a new strategy

I hope the £££££'s being raked in will lead to a subsidy and discount of council tax

deepak

Foggy Eyes

10-02-2007, 18:48

oops, just repeated a reply from before!

Foggy Eyes

10-02-2007, 18:54

Surely most people have some idea of how much the car costs them to run.

Mine works out like this;
Insurance £900
Tax £168
Service £250
MOT £40
Petrol £700 ish (depends obviously, but 11.25p/mile)

Depreciation is harder to assess, probably about 1k/year for my car.

So just over 3k/annum for me. Given that I definitely don't only travel within south yorkshire, and the huge amount of time it saves me compared to public transport, it's well worth it.
I guess for most people the question is one of time and convenience, how much is an hour of your day, 5 days a week worth. When you add up that 1 hour (and for me it's more than that) it's 220hrs a year, sat on a bus, in the cold (or the hot), with someone smelly sat beside you playing gangsta rap too loud on their cheap headphones, or stood on the tram because there are no seats free.

that's the point isn't it, you can do far more with a car than you can public transport.

however, i walk so much these days, and have don't really think about the time issues - yes it often takes longer but i don't really care. also, if i need a car i hire one. we hired around 8 vehicles last year for weekends/holidays etc and i worked out that this cost around £800 inc petrol. so i'm still quids in.