I have recently began to write my father's WWII story and have written to the Red Cross in Switzerland for his POW record. In their reply they noted that he spent some time in Camp 17 in Great Britain.

Further research tells me that Camp 17 was located in Lodge Moor, Redmires Road, Sheffield, which led me to this site.

My father was an Italian captured in North Africa, sent to South Africa, then to Sheffield, before being transferred to Camp 35 in Boughton Park, near Kettering.

I am slowly piecing together the years he spent in Great Britain.

Can anyone give me any information on this camp or direct me to any website that might be helpful. I would especially like to see pictures of the site, while it was a POW camp or as it looks today.

A heartfelt thank you to anyone who takes the time to help.

Mary
Ontario, Canada

Use the forum search function on the left of the page and enter "lodge moor". You will get lots of info in various threads.

The site was originally a Victorian racecourse, then an WW1 army training camp, then a POW camp, then it fell into disrepair and now is a plantation that I can see from my window right now.

It is right opposite the 3 Merry Lads pub and you can find an aerial photo here (http://www.multimap.com/map/photo.cgi?client=public&x=428000.489999383&y=386250.220181367&width=700&height=410&scale=5000&down.x=10&down.y=18). The camp is the plantation to the south of the road. There are still the remains of the buildings and roads in the woods.

I've been in there with my kids (and a metal detector), and if you let your imagination run you can see how it might have been when occupied. There are enough building bases and toilet fittings left to show the layout.

If I ever get the chance to go up there again Mary, I'll get some photos and pass them to you.;)

Ah yes.. the other bit that you might not know is that bit of the moor is called that because there was a hunting lodge on it in days gone by where Mary Queen of Scots used to stay while out hunting in the early days of her 14 years of being a prisoner in Sheffield.

Tony
That's a spot on photo.
Can you walk round the plantation or is it fenced off or private property, and do the people in the gypsy/traveller camp bother if you start hunting around in their back yards ?

I don't think you will have any trouble. The gypsy camp has to be the poshest one ever, so that's no problem. :)

Mary
I live about a mile from the site and have looked in lots of local history books in the library but never seen any photo's of the POW site as it was. If I find any I'll let you know etc. Even searching on Google throws up very few links, as you've probably discovered.

Does any one fancy a walk round the place, maybe one evening or Sunday afternoon etc ?

Col

I take my dog around there at least twice a week. The only thing is parts of it are VERY overgrown and you end up scratched to bits. The only things left are concrete bunker bases and steps, and the old entrance roadway somewhere but I have not been able to find that for a while now. Its spooky after dark I tell you that much........

Originally posted by Tony
.... Mary Queen of Scots used to stay while out hunting in the early days of her 14 years of being a prisoner in Sheffield.


Interesting about the Hunting Lodge. On the 1850 OS map There is a 'Lodge Moor Hall' shown which would have been about where the junction of Blackbrook Ave and Blackbrook Road is now. Rivelin Lodge and Fulwood Hall are also shown on this map as well as many other houses still here in 2004.

Strange how road names have changed since those times....

Lodge Lane used to be Rivelin Mill Lane
Remires Road used to be Lodge Moor Road
Lodge Moor Road used to be Intake Lane
Blackbrook Road used to be Bole (or Bore) Hill Lane

....old maps are fascinating :)

GB
Something like this

http://www.old-maps.co.uk/oldmaps/servlet/GenaImageSourcer?imageId=3078040283.png

This is a good web site to try out.
http://www.old-maps.co.uk/

Col

There's a photo of 'Redmires Camp during WW1' in Peter Harvey's "Sheffield" ISBN 095054583X but it's probably not much of a guide to how the POW camp would have looked.

Just been up there for a walk with the dog. Bit soggy at the moment though (the campsite ANd the dog!) Great place to wander around, there is a network of footpaths, some of which are dead ends and some running around the perimeter, and right through the centre of the camp. A few years back I am sure I found a building still standing somwhere near the original entrance from Redmires Rd which is now bricked up. Cant find it now.....I need to spend a whole day there exploring again.

A metal detector is a must.....

Originally posted by Cols
GB
This is a good web site to try out.
http://www.old-maps.co.uk/
Col
Cols

Yes, that's the site I was looking at....trouble is you can't generate a link to a search result.

Thank you to all who posted a reply to my inquiry.

Are there any older folks who might remember what the building looked like in 1942?

My father remembers being housed in a "castle". The POWs slept on the 3rd or 4th floor and were called to the 1st floor for meals by the ringing of a bell. He remembers that half of the "castle" was in ruins. In the front was an orchard enclosed by a stone wall. The back was a pasture with cows. He cannot remember if this was the Lodge Moor site or one somewhere else. I'm hoping that some older folks can confirm or deny the info above.

Thanks again.
Mary

That's not Lodge Moor. From what I know it was wooden huts, and there is certainly nothing that could be remotely described as a Castle in the area.

definitely not Lodge Moor, no castles in the area at all. However, there were number of big old houses that might have looked a bit like castles, ie some had turrets. These were all bombed out in the 2nd WW, such as THE RIDGE, situated on the road I used to live in, aptly named THE RIDGE after the old house. Perhaps some local large houses were used by the army at this time, especially the ones hit by bombs. THE RIDGE for example was half demolished by a bomb in WW2, and had to be evacuated. Fascinating to finf out more.

THE CAMP itself was all wooden huts yes, and surrounded by a wall on the North side, which is still there, and barbed wire fencing along the perimeters which roughly co-incide with the wooded area which has grown since the 1940's....the woods were not there originally, I think it was a plantation job a bit later.

I've just had a walk over the hill by the observatory. What's with all the caravans beside the plantation. Is it a caravan club meet or have the travellers moved in ?

That's the posh gypsy camp. It's been there as long as I can remember.

I know about the gypsy camp, but last night there were dozens of caravans in the field behind the Sportsman pub. You know the field that people fly kites on etc.

Hmmm no idea - I wonder if it's a rally? They were't there when I took the dog up there early last week.

My brother and I played up there when we were kids. I was scared to go in and thought that we would get into trouble for trespassing. My brother would scare me all the time that ghosts would come out and run us off. He said that we could go up and search for bullets and dead bodies. Creepy place when I was a kid. Then I remember them opening it up for "travellers" Can't remember the year they let the gypsies come but it must have been in the mid 80s. Anyway, the locals up at Lodgemoor protested (of course) and all the posh houses invested in security alarm systems for their houses. We all thought that one really bad winter up on the moors would send them packing elsewhere. Living in a caravan surrounded by snowdrifts can be brutal up at Lodgemoor even for the locals. But when I visited home last year the gypsies were still there and it's still a scary place!

Mary
I've just returned from the library and after a couple of hours I found a picture of the camp in one of the local history books. If you pm me with your email address I'll get it to you. It's only a small photo (4x3") but it gives you idea of the place and the countryside that surrounds it.

Col

Col,

I have tried the "pm" but I'm told that I cannot use it because I don't have 5 posts.

Mary

It turns out that the campsite behind the Sportsman is a dog agility rally (is that the right word?). Not had a chance to go yet - the dog's shattered after this mornings walk :)

Mary
I've pm'd you but if you can't receive them you'll have to post a couple more times.
Whereabouts are you in Canada.
I once spent a couple of weeks in the Jasper/Banff area. What a beautiful part of the world it is.

Hello Cols

I live in Ontario. In the outskirts of Toronto.

We have been to the Banff area. You're right, the scenery is beautiful.

I think this is my fourth post.

Mary

This is Post no. 5.

During WW2 as a kid, I used to go walking with my parents past the POW camp. It wasn't just used by Italian POWs but by Germans too. Toward the end of the war, they began letting prisoners come into town quite freely, where they would spend whatever money they got from working the fields in the market. My cousin Jean got very friendly with a German prisoner and since I spoke German used to translate their love letters. A lot of fun for a teenage kid!!. The Italians had a small camp just outside Stony Middleton, and we were able to go get them cigarettes and walk into camp with them. They would pay us beforehand and we never cheated on them and always did what they asked. They may have been the enemy,but they fought bravely as our men did, and we always respected that. It's a different world today and not for the better

By the way, Mary, I lived in Montreal for many years, on the west island. We were great rivals in Hockey with the Maple Leafs. I also spent some time in Newfie, and that is an experience! I finally moved to New England, which to me is the best of the USA.

Mary
I have emailed you the picture. Hope it comes out ok. Is your father still alive ?

Col

In the late sixties and early seventies the old camp was used as a large lambing enclosure .The problem was finding the new lambs that wandered in to trees which where only 5-6ft tall and close together.They must be well over 20ft tall if they are still there.

paulr

The trees are out of control now. Its a total jungle in the middle.....

You're right there. It must be time for the trees to be felled. Mind you, it would probably cause an outcry from those who don't understand that they are there for agriculture, not just the view. :roll:

During the war as a child I lived across the valley on Rails Rd,and on Sunday mornings we used to walk across to Lodge Moor and on fine summer mornings stand on the wall and look into the camp where Mass?was being celebrated with the Priests in their white vestments and the rows of POW in drab brown clothes with big red circular patches on their backs and trouser legs

Hi mary I'm fm london ontario we was in the fulwood homes during the war and had walk quite often past P.O.W camps, walking toward the lodge moor hospital,all the camps where on the left facing the open moor with their rings of caves,at that time to my young eyes the Italian p.o.w's seemed to come and go quite freely as we saw lots on the road, later on when the Germans moved into the camp next door (Icould wrong about their location) it was a different story I didn't see them untill around 1945.
hope this tad of info helps.

I have a tin of old German and Italian coins and notes, I'm told my dad used to go up there and sell stuff to the POWs.

hi mary just seen your post my mum passed away nov 05,i am trying to do a family tree and found out my mums dad was an italian pow we were told he died on a ship on the way back home,we know his name is guiseppe saffronelli not sure if this is right spelling but sounds like it)is there a named list anywhere of pow that you know off.

thanks paul

didnt the italian p o w,s help build parson cross housing estate ?

how about checking sheffield library archives for pics or info ? any one got a link ?

As a child we went to Lodge Moor for outings, there were people from all nationalities there and they came and went as they pleased, I met a German man When I first came to Oz who had been in there and he told me many stories about what they did and how they went to the 3 Merry Lads all the time, don't know where they got their money from, but they were treated a lot better than our lads were overseas.

try using google earth to look its ace

[QUOTE=depoix]didnt the italian p o w,s help build parson cross housing estate ?

I remember the Italians and the Germans building the Parson cross estate
up to I think 1947.