I am aware that in Judaism drinking of alcohol is not forbidden and in Islam it is forbidden however where does Christianity stand on the matter?

Conservative religious people have always regarded alcohol as sinful. Some churches oppose the selling of alcoholic beverages close to their buildings or distribute literature opposing the pleasurable consumption of alcoholic beverages at all. Many elders, preachers and congregations throughout the churches of Christ oppose alcohol on biblical grounds.

The pleasurable consumption of alcohol is condemned in the Old Testament. Priests were forbidden to consume alcohol under penalty of death (Leviticus 10:8-11).

"And the Lord spake unto Aaron, saying, Do not drink wine nor strong drink, thou, nor thy sons with thee, when ye go into the tabernacle of the congregation, lest ye die: it shall be a statute for ever throughout your generations: And that ye may put difference between holy and unholy, and between unclean and clean; And that ye may teach the children of Israel all the statutes which the Lord hath spoken unto them by the hand of Moses."

Bit odd that Jesus would turn water into wine as he supposedly did in one of his miracles if he was against the drinking of alcohol.

Didn't Jesus turn water into wine? It doesn't look as though he disapproved!

Oops, a bit slow off the mark there.

it isn't forbidden - just suggested you shouldn't....

It probably falls under the "well it said not to in the Old testament, but we don't realy follow that any more (unless it suits us) because it was superceded by the stuff Jesus said, and he didn't mention it, so it's ok" rule.

saint paul said " take a little wine for your stomach,s sake " so i suppose its ok,then jesus did tutn wine into water and they had wine at the last supper so i would reckon its safe to assume the church doesnt have a downer on it

I think the Methodists are pretty anti-drink.
Not sure if its totally forbidden, but it certainly is on their church premises.

Other than that I think its generally accepted in moderation.

I can perform miracles too.
Last night i downed a bottle of wine, this morning i turned it back into water............

John 2:1 -11
1On the third day a wedding took place at Cana in Galilee. Jesus' mother was there, 2and Jesus and his disciples had also been invited to the wedding. 3When the wine was gone, Jesus' mother said to him, "They have no more wine."
4"Dear woman, why do you involve me?" Jesus replied, "My time has not yet come."
5His mother said to the servants, "Do whatever he tells you."
6Nearby stood six stone water jars, the kind used by the Jews for ceremonial washing, each holding from twenty to thirty gallons.[a]
7Jesus said to the servants, "Fill the jars with water"; so they filled them to the brim.
8Then he told them, "Now draw some out and take it to the master of the banquet."
They did so, 9and the master of the banquet tasted the water that had been turned into wine. He did not realize where it had come from, though the servants who had drawn the water knew. Then he called the bridegroom aside 10and said, "Everyone brings out the choice wine first and then the cheaper wine after the guests have had too much to drink; but you have saved the best till now."

Doesn't sound like he was all that opposed to alcohol to me.

I believe that alcohol, in the form of a small amount of wine, is used for sacramental purposes by some Christians, much as cannabis is used by Rastas (though not for mood-altering purposes in the case of the Christians). I believe it's supposed to represent the blood of Christ, and some Christians even believe that it changes into blood on its way down :gag: (though many Christians would take this figuratively, and some others would argue casuistically (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transubstantiation) that it sort of does and sort of doesn't literally change).

If its any use I've not seen owt in the bible that disapproves of weed, so if you're really unsure of the right way to stay away from eternal damnation it might be a good idea to sack the booze 4 a bit and skin up instead? :)

Surely the whole get-out clause of christianity is that you can commit whatever sin you like so long as you pray for forgiveness afterwards? ;)

It probably falls under the "well it said not to in the Old testament, but we don't realy follow that any more (unless it suits us) because it was superceded by the stuff Jesus said, and he didn't mention it, so it's ok" rule.

I find this a grey area as its forbidden in the old testament as is flesh of swine, i suppose it may be down to interpretation of the bible by different Christians.

Given that Christianity is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ, in the New Testament, I think that relying on the Old Testament isn't too useful.

I think the Methodists are pretty anti-drink.
Not sure if its totally forbidden, but it certainly is on their church premises.

Other than that I think its generally accepted in moderation.


"pretty anti-drink" I'm pretty entirely sure there completely anti-drink!

My understanding of The Bible is that the Old Testament is to be followed by the Jews, and Christians follow the testament. How the two can contradict each other, yet are bundled together, is something I've never understood. I think of it as giving away a copy of Socialist Worker free with every copy of the Telegraph...

Now, what does the New Testament say about alcohol? King Lemuel (often often considered to be the wise King Solomon) quotes his mother as saying:


It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink:
Lest they drink, and forget the law, and pervert the judgment of any of the afflicted.
Give strong drink unto him that is ready to perish, and wine unto those that be of heavy hearts.
Let him drink, and forget his poverty, and remember his misery no more.

Proverbs 31:4-7 (King James Version)


So strong drink affects your judgement and is only for the dying, the depressed and the destitute...

Other New Testament verses warning against consuming alcohol in excess (if not alcohol per se) include:


Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh

Proverbs 23:30 (King James Version)


I believe that certain bible interpretations take winebibbers to mean those who drink too much, while others take it to mean drinking in general.


Woe unto them that rise up early in the morning, that they may follow strong drink; that continue until night, till wine inflame them!

Isaiah 5:11-14 (King James Version)


I am aware that it is mentioned in the bible that Jesus turned water into wine, but I'm highly sceptical that God would permit something as destructive to society as alcohol to be freely consumed.

Some interpretations I've read of such verses imply that the wine mentioned in the New Testament was grape juice rather than fermented, alcoholic beverage.

Can't be bothered readin it to see if anyone's pointed this BLATENTLY obvious fact out...... Err drinkin wine for the blood of Christ????? You plank!:hihi: :hihi: :loopy:

Given that Christianity is based on the teachings of Jesus Christ, in the New Testament, I think that relying on the Old Testament isn't too useful.
That's not really true, most variants of Christianity that I’m aware of pick and choose bits to follow and ignore from both the old and new testaments. If this wasn’t the case I there would be no creationists.

"pretty anti-drink" I'm pretty entirely sure there completely anti-drink!


knowing the methodists i know, including the ministers...

they are not completely anti-drink...

a glass of wine with dinner is perfectly acceptable in the modern methodist church as is the odd beer etc, jsut within reason and not to excess

they still do not have alcohol on the premises though

Aye I know a sweet girl from the church on the dual carraigeway just off the university roundabout... they go for a swift half after church n that...

a glass of wine

What's the point of that... :confused: :hihi:

I know meaks.... why do you think i ran as far as i could ;)

That's not really true, most variants of Christianity that I’m aware of pick and choose bits to follow and ignore from both the old and new testaments. If this wasn’t the case I there would be no creationists.


Yes, what with female priests, and now gay priests, it seems the original teachings have been rewritten in order to appeal to secular modernists.

I've often thought about joining the Landover Baptist (http://www.landoverbaptist.org) ministry, who take the KJV1611 edition to be the unchanged and literal word of God.

Get your wallet out though - the ministry has a fleet of aircraft to maintain ;)

it seems the original teachings have been rewritten in order to appeal to secular modernists
Well I wouldn't go so far as to say that it appeals to secularists, but yes, some Christians are making an attempt to come to terms with the modern world, good luck to them :thumbsup:

Umm ... not sure, but I think that Landover Baptist site may be satirical ...

Yes, what with female priests, and now gay priests, it seems the original teachings have been rewritten in order to appeal to secular modernists.
This isn't a new thing it's been a constant since Christianity first began, just how many Christians have ever paid any attention to Jesus’ comments about rich men camels and needles for example?

Oh No!!
I really want to comment on this post but I have to go out in like 2 minutes....errrrrmmm... errr...
OK I'll be back at 11!!!!
See you all later.............:wave:

OK.

What needs to be established is, 'what does the Bible say?' What Mildred the Christian down the road does, or the Methodists round the corner, is irrelevant.
What does the New Testament teach?

(BTW Abdul, Proverbs isn't NT, neither is Isaiah)

Its quite clear that it is not a problem to drink Alcohol. As has been rightly stated, Jesus' first miracle was to turn water in to wine at a wedding.

The prohibition is getting drunk.
"And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit; " Ephesians 5 :18.

I did want to pick up on a few comments about the Old Testament and New Testament differences etc., but it's 1120 and I've got work in the morning.
Maybe over the weekend if this thread hasn't already died a death by then.

I'm a bit surprised that so far no-one has mentioned the Salvation Army.
Didn't they found Temperence Halls?

A lot of Methodists are teetotal and alcohol is strictly banned on church premises. They even use non-alcoholic wine when taking communion.

I had a "fundie-Christian" (exclusive brethren, IIRC) friend who was vehemently anti-drink, and she was adamant that the bible forbade alcohol, and that the "wine" that Jesus created from the water was simply grape juice.... and not fermented, (grape "must", it's called.)

I found that standpoint particularly odd. a) because I never read one verse in the bible that says that He turned water into "Schloer"...

and b) the guests present at the wedding, who were served with the wine comented to the host, on the quality of the wine, saying "normally the poor wine is kept for last, but this wine is the best!" now, I'm sure that even if they were drunk, they'd suss immediately if someone were trying to pass Schloer off as wine!

I do know that most, if not all Methodist buildings (churches and church halls) do have a covenant placed on them, that they may not permit the sale or consumption of alcohol on the church property.

edit to add, Redrobbo and I have simulposted!

PT

Good point on point b, P.T.
Christians adding extra rules to Biblical commands drives me up the wall.

what about crystal meth seen as it wasn't around, or is this morally ok in religious morals. does this disprove god.