Hi
Just back from holiday this week on the Fens.

Had the dubious pleasure of trying to contact the Police after a suspected robbery did not know where exactly. But it was about 100yds (old Money) across the road. Rang at 10.30pm could not get the call handler to even identify where the village we called at least three times then they turned up two hours later. Did a check and found nothing

Found out later the person had had force used against him threatened. He was 85 then told not to contact anyone while the morning.

Found out the call had been received 20+ miles away in Peterbrough ( sounded like India) and the didn't know the area.

Are we in south Yorkshire are expecting to have our forced merged with Humberside (god help us). How are they going to know areas the don't live near.

Do you get similar problems in Norfolk?

Great stuff, as crime reaches epic proportions, this is just what we need in South Yorkshire.

So you didn't know where you were, but you expected the police to know your exact location?

Perhaps their crystal ball was in for repair.

Emergency service control rooms often have to cover an enormous geographical area, and (contrary to union PR) the operators do not generally have encyclopaedic local knowledge. They have the benefits of digital mapping, landline telephone number/address lists, and have the facility to track mobile phones to a rough area.

So you didn't know where you were, but you expected the police to know your exact location?

Perhaps their crystal ball was in for repair.

Emergency service control rooms often have to cover an enormous geographical area, and (contrary to union PR) the operators do not generally have encyclopaedic local knowledge. They have the benefits of digital mapping, landline telephone number/address lists, and have the facility to track mobile phones to a rough area.

Yes I did know were I was. Shouldn't they have the latest computer something like sat nav. Someone was on the phone vertually on and off for 20 mins.

Oh we've had this before with ambulances. The person in the call centre wants to know what road the incident has occured on. You tell them "Its at the Shalesmoor Tram Stop"

"Yes but what road"
"The Shalesmoor tram stop"
"But which road?"
"I don't know, it's a junction"
"Is he breathing?"
"I don't know I'm just ringing from the pub"
" Can you go and check?"
"He's outside down the road..alright I'll go and bloody check"

Phone is dead...there is a wait...landlord returns

"Yes he's breathing"
"Where are you calling from?"
"Does it bloody matter, he's outside at the tram stop?"

This goes on for some time until landlord gives up and puts phone down. Luckily sirens are heard ten minutes later.

Result of mergers = millions of pounds spent on integrating computer systems on a regional basis, hundreds of thousands per force spent on uniform changes, government claiming that this is another step forward for the Police and efficiency at fighting crime on a regional basis. Millions spent on the necessary bureacracy to integrate policies from various forces into one organisation.

No more fully trained officers on the streets, increased use of PCSO's to show the uniform visibility.

Result of mergers = millions of pounds spent on integrating computer systems on a regional basis, hundreds of thousands per force spent on uniform changes, government claiming that this is another step forward for the Police and efficiency at fighting crime on a regional basis. Millions spent on the necessary bureacracy to integrate policies from various forces into one organisation.


Not so, the PNC is already a national database and the merging of regional intelligence will bring together much needed data and enable detectives to search fewer forces and get faster results.

Agreed in the short term money will be needed to change uniforms vehicle livery etc, but they will not scrap existing kit just to change the force emblem overnight.

In the long term money will be saved on administrative roles and also in centralising certain departments, this will concentrate skills and should create a far leaner more efficient service.

As far the earlier comments of Police knowing exactly where an emergency call is being made, that's just naive to think that a mobile phone or indeed a landline can be triangulated or traced in a few minutes. If a person is to call the 999 service, they should make sure that they give as much info as possible to aid in the quickest possible response. A 999 call will be circulated in a few minutes to local patrols if it sounds serious and/or legitimate, the beat bobbies should have a good enough understanding of their beat area to then get to at least within a few hundred metres of the incident with the vaguest of info. 999 calls are not abandoned by the control room and if the line is left open it will be traced and a car sent to that location as soon as possible.

No amount of reorganisation is ever going to cure the problem of the attitude of the police in Cambridgeshire - Particularly Peterborough. I have first hand experience of them not wanting to know on more than one occassion, and have nothing but priase for SY police, so am rather concerned as to how this new super force is to be 'managed'.

I hope they don't manage to nark off all the best people in the force and leave those who conform to the 'not my problem' approach of policing :mad:

Razorsharp - the PNC is just one of many systems the Police use. You are quite wrong to suggest that the mergers will not cost exhorbitant amounts of money. Not only that, the integration of systems will take considerable time to put in place.

This government do not exactly have a track record of excellence in putting in place large and effective IT systems. There is no reason to believe that this exercise willdo anything to change their ability in that vein.

This plan will cost massive amounts of money and divert time and energy away from the really important people in the Police - those wearing the uniform and Policing the streets.

It is estimated to cost £600 million for the initial transistion. Not sure if that includes corrallating all computer networks as all are different. PNC will not be affected, as its a Police National Computer.
Triangulation is possible but needs to be done with the phone providers help, which can be slow (not always) and is definitely expensive. The questions asked by call handlers are for a reason and its to get as much information as possible for the responding service. "Man lying with bleeding stomach in street, get here now" could be "Man lying with shotgun wound, offender is close by but I'm too busy screaming down the phone to realise I'm putting other peoples lives in danger", its just some people get over excited when making calls and cannot cope with the situation, hence the feeling that all questions are un-necessary. Just becuase you kno where you are, does not mean the call handler does. For whatever reason, SYP call handlers are centralized in one office block in SYP. Sometimes people may have to cover for colleagues.
As for using a Sat Nav to locate someone, you would need to be in that location itself for that to be effective, wouldn't you?

Yes I did know were I was. Shouldn't they have the latest computer something like sat nav. Someone was on the phone vertually on and off for 20 mins.
The systems involved in Computer Aided Dispatch are very sophisticated, but are only as good as the information that's fed into it - if the caller is clueless it's going to cause problems!

Oh we've had this before with ambulances. The person in the call centre wants to know what road the incident has occured on. You tell them "Its at the Shalesmoor Tram Stop"

"Yes but what road"
"The Shalesmoor tram stop"
"But which road?"
"I don't know, it's a junction"
"Is he breathing?"
"I don't know I'm just ringing from the pub"
" Can you go and check?"
"He's outside down the road..alright I'll go and bloody check"

Phone is dead...there is a wait...landlord returns

"Yes he's breathing"
"Where are you calling from?"
"Does it bloody matter, he's outside at the tram stop?"

This goes on for some time until landlord gives up and puts phone down. Luckily sirens are heard ten minutes later.

Do you think the ambulance service asks these questions because the operator is bored or lonely?

When the ambulance is sent, it is often useful to have a precise location for where they are required, rather than a vague description (usually "Somewhere on the M1 after the Sheffield turn off - no, I haven't stopped..."). When they ask you if the patient is breathing, it is to prioritise the call, and for life threatening conditions, to stay on the phone with you to give you emergency first aid advice prior to the ambulance arrival.

As S92DA says, deflecting your sense of panic onto the call handler as anger will not help - stay calm and do as you are told!